Discuss drumming technique here
User avatar
By michi
#28027
Almost every teacher I've had has "rudiments", even though he would never call them by that name. Warm-up exercises, in particular, often work a particular technique or movement.

I see no reason why we couldn't have rudiments for djembe. They'd necessarily be different from the 40 for drum kit, mainly because double strokes are rare for traditional djembe technique. But there are some very challenging ones, such as Mamady's Balakulania phrase.

We could probably create a collection. Just post examples of your favourite exercises. Could be a challenge for all of us to work on :)

Michi.
User avatar
By rachelnguyen
#28028
This question starts to get at HOW we are learning on djembe or dundun. In my case, my teacher has never really sat down and explained rudiments of either djembe or dundun... but has chosen the order in which he teaches rhythms based on their complexity and the skills they develop. Starting with Dansa, for example, on both djembe and dundun lays a foundation. Some of the phrases in Madan start to introduce pretty complex stuff. (I don't even know what to call it when a bass hit and a tone or slap happen nearly simultaneously... but I have encountered it in several phrases and now can play it.) For me, the language of djembe and dundun has been laid on a foundation without me even knowing. I didn't realize it until I started to be able to pick up new things more quickly because I recognize components from other pieces.

Having said all that, my list of rudiments would be virtually impossible to share. It would be something like this:

Djembe:

Bass
Tone
Slap
flam
That slide thing that happens in the 4th phrase of Madan
The accompaniments for koreduga and Sunu,
etc.
:-)
By bkidd
#28032
Some of the phrases in Madan start to introduce pretty complex stuff. (I don't even know what to call it when a bass hit and a tone or slap happen nearly simultaneously... but I have encountered it in several phrases and now can play it.)
I would typically call this a flam, which seems to be the general term for when both hands hit the drum very close in time, regardless of wether the hands are playing the same or different sounds.
For me, the language of djembe and dundun has been laid on a foundation without me even knowing. I didn't realize it until I started to be able to pick up new things more quickly because I recognize components from other pieces.
This has happened with me too. It's neat to be able to recognize new things more easily after building a strong foundation of techniques, patterns, sounds, and feeling.

Best,
-Brian
User avatar
By e2c
#28035
I don't even know how to reply, TNT.

I am not claiming for one second to "represent" Africa or Africans in any way. I think perhaps it would be best for me to bow out of this discussion; it seems that we are both misreading each other.

My apologies for any offense given - please know that it was not intentional on my part.

not that it matters, but... I am a few years older than you.

I do hope that your experience with Latin music will lead you to want to investigate African music.
User avatar
By rachelnguyen
#28038
I can't quite understand where the offense came from, but it doesn't seem like anyone was trying to stifle your momentum, TNT.

From my perspective, western drumming rudiments are perfectly fine for someone who wants to play djembe in a non-traditional way... but for someone that is playing the djembe in the traditional style, the western rudiments probably won't apply. That isn't the same as saying they aren't valuable... it is just a matter of application. In my case, I am perfectly happy not even knowing what a paradiddle IS, lol. I am learning traditional style from a Malian teacher and the language and 'rudiments' are different.
By djembeweaver
#28041
TNT: Please be aware that this is a forum where people are used to debating things. That inevitably means that from time to time people will disagree with what you (and I) say. When someone disagrees with you that's not an end to the discussion...it's a beginning! It invites you to explain why you disagree.

Your statement 'Rudiments are called rudiments because they apply to any drum' is an interesting claim that deserves discussion. If you engage with my argument and explain your point of view, and I do the same, the chances are we will both learn something. For my part I will learn about rudiments and you might learn something about traditional west african djembe techniques. Win win I say ;)

Another example is that you clearly think that by making a distinction between 'west african' and 'western' techniques one is putting oneself in a box. I think the opposite. I think that by learning another culture's music you break out of a box. This doesn't mean you have offended me, or that I am acting as some sort of 'culture police'. It just means we disagree. This should not be the end of the discussion...it should be the beginning, where we both explain our position and maybe....just maybe....arrive at a common understanding. You are clearly a very experienced drummer who has been playing for many years. I have lived in west africa for 3 years and have studied djembe for about 12 years. I'm sure we could both teach each other a thing or two!

In short don't be so easily offended and please keep the discussion going ;)

Jon
By djembeweaver
#28043
OK Jurgen. You are the voice of reason here. I will do as you suggest. I do think it's a shame though, since I was very interested in people's opinion of what would constitute rudiments on a djembe. Should I start a separate thread for that (or just forget it entirely since it seems an incendiary topic)?

Jon
User avatar
By michi
#28045
I think collecting djembe rudiments would be an interesting exercise regardless!

As to deleting posts, while the discussion has become a little heated at times, I don't think it was out of bounds. And, seeing how this thread is evolving, I would at least consider not deleting anything and to let it stand for the record. I think there have been good and reasonable attempts by various people at resolving the conflict and turning the discussion towards a constructive outcome. Personally, I think it would be a shame to lose the record of this. But, of course, it is up to each and every poster him- or herself to decide whether to delete something.

Jürgen, if you decide to delete your post, please re-post the links to the videos. That's some very skilled drumming there. Very non-traditional, but I really like this a lot! It would be a shame to lose it.

Cheers,

Michi.