Advice and questions on making and fixing instruments
By Des804
#37981
I hope its called Roll and tuck but I am trying to find a YT Video that showed how to do it accurately considering last time I tried to do it, it looked like someone sat on it. Its where you take the extra skin around the Drum and you roll it all the way around to help with slippage. Figured Someone might know where I can see that video showing how to do it is.
By Paul
#37985
Ah yes, I have come across it when not looking for it and then not seen it when I wanted it. Have some idea it was a French guy, so perhaps looking through youtube.fr or in french. Djembe montage.

you cut skin to about an inch excess, then using a very thin pliers, like a jewllers pliers start twisting at an angle and move around the drum. Hard part seems to be poking the end of the twist under the rim to stop it unravelling.
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By boromir76
#37989
Very effective anti slipage measure!

There is one thing to be litlle carreful of when putting wet skin on with this rolling edge: The tensioning ring has to be brought enough down, under the drum edge. The thing is that skin roll very effectively blocks the skin from any slipping once the skin is being tensioned and the ring will not drop down as much as with usual edges, where at least minimal slippage occures very often. To high initial ring position will therefore result in bumping the hand into the roll while playing slaps.
Last edited by boromir76 on Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:11 am, edited 3 times in total.
#38102
I really like using this method to finish off the skin. After I roll it, I use thin cord 2-3mm through the loop knots or under the top verts if there is room and do star patterns across the head... this holds the twist in place until it dries. I usually don't hit every knot, maybe every other one or so. With a thick skin or one that has a thick neck it likes to unfold. This method works well for me.
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By drtom
#38106
boromir76 wrote:There is one thing to be litlle carreful of when putting wet skin on with this rolling edge: The tensioning ring has to be brought enough down, under the drum edge.
Good point, especially to someone like me, who goes with the really tight wet pull starting with a really tight ring wrap.

Is that the correct term - 'ring wrap'?
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By drtom
#38124
I don't know if that's the correct term drtom, but today I thought of something that should have occurred to you years ago: the roll and tuck is perfect for ashikos. You've had slippage issues with American made ashikos - way over sized rings and way too few knots. The roll and tuck should help alleviate the problem.

By sheer coincidence I had an ashiko to skin today and, thanks to this thread, the light bulb finally lit up. :doh: Yep, I roll and tucked it.
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By michi
#38143
I doubt that the skin roll would do much to prevent skin slip. Maybe towards the end, after the skin has slipped some distance already…

If you have issues with skin slip, re-size the rings so the fit tightly, and use a double-loop cow hitch. End of skin slippage, permanently.

Michi.
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By drtom
#38151
michi wrote:I doubt that the skin roll would do much to prevent skin slip. Maybe towards the end, after the skin has slipped some distance already…
I don't know michi. With practice, I think you can do a really tight roll wedged well in. As the skin dries it tightens more.

For what it's worth, I've never seen a roll and tuck slip. Of course, I don't see a roll and tuck every day.
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By batadunbata
#38153
Looks a little messy imo. It's ok, but here's a couple other ideas:

1. Wrap the flesh ring in friction tape or nonslip fabric (the mesh kind with rubber on it for placing under rugs etc)

2. Harden the part of the skin that wraps the flesh ring to harden it so it can't flex around the ring, by applying glue to it before putting the ring on (pretreat ring with wax to prevent the glue from sticking to it).

3. Make grip/teeth or bumps on the flesh ring for friction. Can use glue, or glue+sand or glue+sawdust. Could even make ridges by gluing strips of wood or fabric hardened with glue to the rings, so the bands can bite into the skin.

4. Instead of metal rings which are made of round metal rods welded into a circle, make your own ring out of wood veneer, so it can have square edges to help lock the skin. (Make by wrapping veneer edging/banding around the drum multiple times in a spiral, with glue joining the layers)
I'm sure someone will say "but wood isn't strong enough" - maybe so, but hunting bows are made of wood veneer glued together - it's much stronger than wood because it's a composite material. Using a flexible but hard wood like maple or elm it should be plenty strong enough and lighter than steel.
Bamboo slats would also work, but wood veneer is available in rolls, so easier to work with.