Micro-timing

[haworth]

I have a general question about how seriously people are taking the idea of "Micro-timing" in their playing and/or notation?

I came to Guinea with
1. A lot of reading but little playing in preparation
2. A plan to learn to play and to develop a new notation that reflects the music more "musically"
3. A plan for how I would notate the "issues of micro-timing"

I was blessed to gain a wonderful djembefola, Moussa Sylla, who has worked with me for two years. As I listen carefully to his music I can hear that he adds tiny details and differences to each rendition (ala Mozart?!) but, just as he would never play a piece the same way twice, he would never expect me to play *exactly* as he does. I'm to learn the technique and the rhythms, and then I am to make the music my own.

I had *planned* to deal with micro-timing. Instead I have found that it doesn't seem all that important. It is the player who takes the "notes" and turns them into "music."

So, am I wrong? And if I did add micro-timing to my notation, *which* version would I choose?!

I knew about this forum before but never participated. Now I have lots of questions so you may hear from me again!

Janice AKA "Djembe Djanice"
Dubreka, Guinea

[michi]

Hi Janice,

yes, micro-timing is important and, for certain rhythms, you would be expected to play them with the correct micro-timing. But, as far as I know, there is no formal notation for it, certainly not one that would be in common use. I guess you could come up with your own symbols to mean (retard this, advance that). I'm not sure how effective that would be. In general, I play by ear, not by notation and, once I recall the feel of a rhythm, the micro-timing falls out sort of for free, because it is part of the melody I remember.

In my opinion, the best thing is to have sample recordings for the rhythms you notate. That way, a 10-second sound sample will explain far more than a whole page of notation. (To me, notation is there merely to jog my memory. Once my memory kicks in, I don't need it anymore.)

Rainer Polak has done quite a bit of academic work on micro-timing. Here is a link. (He's written articles on the topic, as far as I know):

http://tcd.freehosting.net/djembemande/microtiming.html

You could try and get in touch with him to ask whether he knows of any formal notations. (PM me for email address.)

Cheers,

Michi.

[djembeweaver]

I wouldn't bother trying to represent micro timing in notation. It'll just make it unecessarily complicated. Anyway, as you point out micro timing is a very fluid thing. Although mendiani might have the same type of swing in Mali and Guinea they tend to swing it more in Mali. That said there will be a lot of variation across different players etc.

Even Polak doesn't do this (as far as I know). What Polak does is identify the form of the micro timing. For example soko usually has a long first beat so it can be characterised by LVV (long; variable; variable). Within that framework lots of possibilities exist e.g LSM (Long; short; medium), LMM etc. Further variations will exist within each of these across regions, players and maybe even across time and context.

For these reasons to try and build micro timing into notation will be cumbersome and unhelpful. However, if you just wrote 'LMS' at the beginning of the score that would tell you roughly what you need to know. This is what happens in classical score for swing - they just write 'swing' then score it as normal. Keep it simple.

[haworth]

Thanks for the info.

Are we trying to *copy* their playing?

Janice

[djembeweaver]

Are we trying to *copy* their playing?

Personally I tend to study quite intensively with one fola who's playing I really like. I've done a lot of work with Iya Sako over the last couple of years. I don't intentionally try to reproduce (or copy) his microtiming because whenever I do that I over swing it and it all sounds wrong. I just find that if I study with the same person for long enough I start to internalise their micro timing so that whenever I play their phrases I play with their swing.

That said I've studied rhythms like Mendiani quite intensively with several different teachers and it always has the same 'type' of swing (a short first beat). This is what makes Mendiani beautiful to my ear so yes, I am trying to reproduce the Mendiani swing by internalising the micro timing of my teachers.

[djembefeeling]

So, am I wrong? And if I did add micro-timing to my notation, *which* version would I choose?!

Hi Janice,

I do add microtiming into my notation, and it helps me a lot. I do work with a simple pulsation system like the one you can see in many of the discussions here on the forum, the djembefola notation system. but I use geometrical symbols like squares, circles, and triangles insted of letters just because I can see them better from a distance. I use a rough shift in the microtiming, and thanks to the symbols, I can see from the space between the symbols how close or distant they are to played. I do use only one spacing for one family of rhythms, and only in extreme instances of phrasing I care about additionals space between the symbols.

So why do I not just go for the easy solution that Jon recommended, writing something like LVV in the beginning? because I found that microtiming is not always continuous throughout one piece of djembe music. Sega Cissé for example, a Malian djembefola based in Bamako, plays some phrases in Sunu with a swing feel and then shifts to the typical SVVV feel of that rhythm. It would be hard to read my notation on that one by writing the feel above every single phrase. But with more or less space between the symbols I can see it quite easily. Or take some rhythm from the Dja family like Soko. Some phrases are played in a binary feel, some in the typical LVV, and some are played totaly straight in equidistance. As you said, this music is so complex, all these shift in the mcrotiming are important means to make this music rhythmically so interesting.

Are we trying to *copy* their playing?

Yes and no, both. It helps me a lot to play along with a master or a recording of a master to get this differences in feel. I did not grow up in that amazing musical culture, so I have to work hard to get the tiny differences in feel -- it took some years to get used to it and it's still work in progress. Sometimes I play along my recordings over and over, until I get it. But mostly I work with my notation instead and play my own feeling that only roughly matches the original. Sometimes I do not even like the "original" way and feel free to change it into something I do like better...

...BTW, would be interesting to listen to some samples of the music you are talking about.

best, jürgen

[rachelnguyen]

Hi Janice,

Welcome to the forum!

I don't use notation at all anymore, just recordings. For me, the notation was really only for handing anyway, and since I mostly play dundun, I don't need to remember hand patterns.

These days I am playing dundun for my teacher at gigs, so yes, I am trying to play exactly the way he teaches it. In fact, I am struggling with the microtiming for Suku (ballet style) right now. It has eluded me for the last couple of weeks, and is frustrating the crap out of me because I can't even hear what I am doing wrong yet. (Very unusual for me. I normally pick this kind of thing up very quickly.) Since I am always playing with my teacher (or other Malians from Bamako) it makes sense for me to use their microtiming. If I don't play it right, my teacher would correct me.

It is great to have you on the forum!
Rachel

[djembeweaver]

So why do I not just go for the easy solution that Jon recommended, writing something like LVV in the beginning? because I found that microtiming is not always continuous throughout one piece of djembe music. Sega Cissé for example, a Malian djembefola based in Bamako, plays some phrases in Sunu with a swing feel and then shifts to the typical SVVV feel of that rhythm. It would be hard to read my notation on that one by writing the feel above every single phrase. But with more or less space between the symbols I can see it quite easily.

Yes that makes sense Jurgen. Like Rachel I don't really notate much these days. I prefer to listen and remember and hopefully internalize. Also, like I said, whenever I try to produce micro-timing consciously it always comes out wrong. Once it's internalized it can't come out any other way!