Crossroads

[Djembe-nerd]

I have been going to this class/west african djembe drumming circle for quite some time now. This is the format we play in.

- the teacher starts the sangban, then kenkeni, then dununba, then gives the parts for the djembe.
- we play and he solos, sometimes he gives the solo to students.

Its good but I have a hard time remebering rhythyms and parts since we play 8-10 rhythyms in one class, and sometimes the parts are changed by him. Though I can play anything that he starts there, I cannot recall if you ask me at home, specially the dunun parts.

I have refernces like Paul Nas website, but I want to learn and remember the rhytym.

Any suggestions.

[e2c]

Would the teacher allow you to record the class? That can be very, very helpful.

Also, are there other people with whom you could get together (outside of class) and play the music?

[Djembe-nerd]

Would the teacher allow you to record the class?

Yes, we can record.

Also, are there other people with whom you could get together (outside of class) and play the music?

One of the students has started doing that, and we were planning to get together outside the class to practice.

Is working on all parts of one rhythym at one stretch a better idea to learn a rhythym OR going part by part till you know it by heart?

[bubudi]

in addition to e2c's advice i would suggest singing the rhythm, both while you're playing in class and afterwards.

it sounds like you're having the toughest time remembering the dunun because you don't spend any time practicing those parts outside of class. practice is essential to progress on any instrument. if you don't already own one, get yourself a sangban and practice each dunun part on it separately. until you get one, you could improvise something (a bucket perhaps) which will allow you to practice the parts with both the open and closed strokes. i would suggest equal practice on the dunun as you give yourself on djembe. dunun parts can be a lot more demanding to learn and understanding the dunun parts is essential to becoming a good djembe player.

also, can you tell us a bit more about your class - what is your teacher's background? does he always go through the same 8 rhythms or does he change to new rhythms every time? 8 rhythms is an awful lot for one class. i remember sitting in on one teacher who used to teach 6 in one class but he'd stick with the same ones for months and non of the class were playing the dunun parts for any rhythm. even so, about half the class struggled to remember the djembe accompaniments and breaks on their own - he would have to cue them first.

it's normal for beginning students to experience difficulty in remembering what parts go with what rhythm. it takes a while of consistent and systematic practice to achieve results. i was lucky enough to be quick to assimilate and memorise things. people with this ability also tend to quickly forget the parts if they don't practice. you can guess the rest...

Is working on all parts of one rhythym at one stretch a better idea to learn a rhythym OR going part by part till you know it by heart?

learning the djembe parts in context (i.e. together with the dunun parts) is important. one or two rhythms per session will give you more practice time per part and therefore better results.

[michi]

it takes a while of consistent and systematic practice to achieve results. i was lucky enough to be quick to assimilate and memorise things. people with this ability also tend to quickly forget the parts if they don't practice.

Yes, I've noticed that too. People who are really quick on the uptake also seem to be really quick at forgetting things again. Mamady mentioned this to me in San Diego. He says that the slow students who don't get it straight away retain the memory pretty much indefinitely once they get it, whereas people who learn quickly have to keep repeating things to keep them pinned in memory.

I suspect it's cost-benefit trade-off: when someone is really quick to learn something, there is less motivation to make the effort to commit the skill to long-term memory because it's easier and less effort to learn it a second time when the skill is needed again. Of course, when it comes to music and building a repertoire, that's a fallacy...

Cheers,

Michi.

[e2c]

I need to play a part for a while; have never been able to simply pick up unfamiliar parts and phrases cold. But... when I get to hear them and play them for a bit, they tend to stick in my mind.

The bottom line (or one of them) is that this all takes time to assimilate, and there really aren't any shortcuts or substitutes for repetition, practice and playing with other people.

Singing the parts is tremendously helpful to me.

[michi]

Singing the parts is tremendously helpful to me.

Yes. That seems to be the case for the majority of people. Singing parts definitely helps to commit them to memory.

Cheers,

Michi.

[bops]

8-10 rhythms per class? Is your teacher ADD?

[Djembe-nerd]

also, can you tell us a bit more about your class - what is your teacher's background? does he always go through the same 8 rhythms or does he change to new rhythms every time

Here is his info. He told us used to drum with Ladji Camara in New York, and when I listen to Ladji I can see the similarity in the style. He is also good friend with Kumbana of Percussion De Guniee and visits him often. The thing is that there is not much inetrest in the west african rhythym learning when it comes to paying and learning so I guess he has to balance the business and class thing, I understand cos I see the people that come there. There are a few really interested to learn actually. Othere have other motivation or hobbies and are not regular and enjoy the rhythyms but not much towards the WA drumming. They like the beat and it takes them somewhere to the spiritual side.

http://www.abubakr.info/

I need to play a part for a while; have never been able to simply pick up unfamiliar parts and phrases cold.

No problem with me, I pick up a new dunun part easily, and forget easily, like Michi said above. Nest time when he will say we will play N'Goron, I will look at him with big eyes, and when he will show me the part once it comes back instantly.

8-10 rhythms per class?

does he always go through the same 8 rhythms or does he change to new rhythms every time? 8 rhythms is an awful lot for one class.

Yes, its any 8-10 rhythyms per class/drumming circle. The reason I think is as above, to keep the other people interested and make them swing in their seats. Usually its me and other older students on the dunun's so the rhythm goes good and the other students play the the djembe parts or if they can;t he gives them something easier to get them involved.

I am going to go to dance classes starting this weekend. That will be good practice to build endurance and speed. The good West African players are very rarely coming to this class I mentioned, but gather separately I will be getting involved there too. I am starting to find out more and I think I am now ready to challange myself more.

[rachelnguyen]

Hey Adam,

How long have you been studying? For me it is nearly three years of constant playing and classes and I am now getting much better at retaining new rhythms. And when you say 8 to 10 rhythms in a class, do you mean solo phrases for the same song? That is how my teacher teaches, too, although usually we start with a base of maybe 3 or 4 phrases for the first time out and add more, one at a time, over the course of the following weeks. In the end we might get to as many as 6 phrases for a single song, but seldom more than that.

I absolutely couldn't retain anything without a recorder. Even if I can remember the handing (which I usually can) I rarely can remember the swing of a phrase, especially a brand new one, without listening to it a few times. And then I practice a LOT before it is committed to memory.

All of it was much harder to retain in the beginning. It is much faster for me now. (Probably can 'get' a phrase in a week instead of much longer.)

Rachel

[Djembe-nerd]

How long have you been studying?

about 8-9 months now.

And when you say 8 to 10 rhythms in a class, do you mean solo phrases for the same song?

No, 8-10 different rhythyms, yesterday we did, toro, soli, N'goron, Mendeani, Fankani, Dala and Lamban.

No solo phrases, just playing the rhythym with all teh parts. we switch the people from dunun's to djembe after 2-3 rhythyms.

[bops]

No, 8-10 different rhythyms, yesterday we did, toro, soli, N'goron, Mendeani, Fankani, Dala and Lamban.

You have to play the rhythm for a longer period of time to get the feel for it. Students won't be able to learn new rhythms at that rate. Your teacher needs to slow down and do 2-3 rhythms MAX per class.

With beginners, I might spend a full hour and a half working on a single rhythm, and just barely scratch the surface.

[Djembe-nerd]

Your teacher needs to slow down and do 2-3 rhythms MAX per class.

I totatly agree, but can;t control that Most of the time and most of the people there don;t come for learning west african rhythyms. They come to have a genuine drumming experience. Some fall out some are in consistent, and I can understand his POV. This is his living.

You have to play the rhythm for a longer period of time to get the feel for it.

Its was good till now. Now when I am comfortanble playing the parts on dunun and djembe, my quest is towards knowing them, not just playing them. I will have to look for more practice somewhere else I guess.

[bubudi]

i understand it's his choice, but a good teacher will listen to his students' needs, and be willing to seek a majority opinion (e.g. ask at the end of a class) and roll with that.

have you asked him about recording the parts to help you learn?

[Djembe-nerd]

have you asked him about recording the parts to help you learn?

Yes, he is Ok with that.

I will try and ask him about changing the format, its worth a try.