Hare, Djalla or Lenke?

[michi]

I think this kind of confusion - or maybe I should say, lumping together of similar woods under the same name - happens a lot with species that aren't native to Europe and the Americas.

Yes, the taxonomy is far from firm. It is also possible that people refer to different species of wood by a single name. Acajou seems a case in point. Heck, even botanists often have a hard time distinguishing species. It is not uncommon for two different species to become a single one because botanists figure out that they are just variants of the same species, or for what used to be a single species to be split into two because the plants differ in some very subtle but crucial detail.

Michi.

[e2c]

I really know nothing about plant taxonomy, beyond what little (very little!) I know about a few of the commoner "tone woods" (like rosewood and cocobolo). And I think that's probably for the best!

[michi]

From my research, my scale looks like this:

Hare, Gele, Iroko, Dimba, Lenke, Djalla, Acajou.

[...]

i wouldn't call iroko hard at all. in fact, i can dent the wood with my finger nail. that's why iroko shells are cut so thick. they aren't dense at all.

I recently built two Iroko shells (both from the same batch from the same supplier). Both were very hard and, despite being quite thin-walled, very heavy.

Well, I decided to do some more research. You can find the results here.

From what I've learned, I'll have to eat my words. The scale probably should look like this:

Hare, Gele, Lenke, Dimba, Djalla, Iroko

Acajou is the odd one out because some people think it is a synonym for Djalla. But there is another related species (Khaya ivorensis) that is also called Acajou. That one is a little softer than Iroko, so it would have to go at the end of the scale.

As to the two Iroko shells I built, I distinctly remember how hard it was to shape the bearing edge, so they were definitely hard, and they were definitely heavy. Either I had a particularly hard example of Iroko or, more likely, the supplier gave me the wrong information. I suspect that they actually were Hare, which would explain both the hardness and the weight. (Hare and Iroko look similar.)

Cheers,

Michi.

[bubudi]

interesting, although i have no experience working with gele wood, from other people's reports i would have put that first. i've worked plenty with gueni/harre and can personally attest that it's definitely on the dense end of the spectrum. i see your values on density and hardness on the other thread. the two woods are very similar in density. do you know how they come up with the values on wood hardness?

[michi]

do you know how they come up with the values on wood hardness?

See this post.

Cheers,

Michi.

[the kid]

From what I've learned, I'll have to eat my words. The scale probably should look like this:
Hare, Gele, Lenke, Dimba, Djalla, Iroko

Dimba is definitly harder than most lenke i've seen. I also rate Djalla harder than lenke. Maybe i've just witnessed softish lenke do.

Hard to make a definitive list as there is so much variance in wood density's and hardness due to climate, soil, sub species and age of tree plus what part of the tree was used.

But there must be some other way to catagorise the wood hardness. What is the water content in these woods. I think we need to get out the micro scope And examine the wood.

Any ways i'm sticking with

Hare - Dimba - Djalla - Lenke - Iroko

[michi]

Dimba is definitly harder than most lenke i've seen. I also rate Djalla harder than lenke. Maybe i've just witnessed softish lenke do.

Hard to make a definitive list as there is so much variance in wood density's and hardness due to climate, soil, sub species and age of tree plus what part of the tree was used.

Yes. There is considerable variation. And I found density values for the same wood that differ by 20% or even more. The density of a particular sample of wood depends on the factors you mention.

But there must be some other way to catagorise the wood hardness. What is the water content in these woods. I think we need to get out the micro scope And examine the wood.

Well, there are the hardness figures. But they are also subject to variability. Lower density is correlated with lower hardness, so there is no sure-fire way to come up with an absolute ranking.

For moisture content, 12% seems to be standard for these measurements.

Any ways i'm sticking with

Hare - Dimba - Djalla - Lenke - Iroko

There is no doubt that Hare is the hardest and that Iroko is the softest. My research also indicates that Gele is a close second after Hare. As for Dimba, Djalla, and Lenke, they are fairly close together and I have no doubt that, depending on the specific shell, the order among those three can be different.

Cheers,

Michi.