There was briefly karma system in place on djembefola.com

[bubudi]

michi, you make some very good points, but it's hard to respond to all the noise you made on several threads - can we just keep it to this thread from now on?

wow, where to begin?

this experiment was only meant to have a very small effect and not to be set up as a blanket for all attachments or all forums on this site. ideally, a more time should have been taken in setting it up right. james spent many hours on this already and i wasn't available at the time to discuss details, so it turned out pretty messy.

in principle, i agree that no one should feel coerced to make a contribution. i think that a lot of people are in their own world though and shy away from interacting at all. it's a syndrome caused by the information age - total anonymity and the ability to acquire all information, files, etc without ever having to have any contact with anyone. that's not what djembe is about. and it's also very unhealthy. in the real world if you ignored everyone and just took what you wanted, you wouldn't get very far. maybe some people need a gentle push.

admittedly, the way the mod was initially installed was not having the intended effect at all. i didn't see the idea as 'creating an elite'. however, before the mod was installed, many people expressed that they would feel a lot more comfortable sharing certain files with certain people. in an ideal world, we would all share everything with everyone. but i think most of us agree that it's just not practical in the world we currently live in.

[bubudi]

one thing that james brought to my attention was that if a person chooses to share a file, they should have control of who they share it with. i agree with this but i think there are some issues around this that we should look at. this is a community and therefore a convenient place to share files, especially in the context of a rhythm of the month discussion (which incidentally is what the karma mod was primarily intended for). it doesn't matter if you share the files through a friends list, through a points system, using upload/download ratios, or using password protection. if people see the message and work out that they are missing the ability to access the file, some people are bound to be disappointed.

however, as we said, if someone wants to share a file, it's his/her prerogative who they want to share it with and if they aren't given a choice how to share it, they are likely not to. so i say give them a few choices:
1. share with everyone (make the file public)
2. share with people on a friends list
3. share with contributing members only

it was suggested that upload/download ratios be used but i consider that to be the worst option as you would not be able to download unless you uploaded something. people who don't have quality files to upload would then either be totally discouraged, or else they would be tempted to upload rubbish or even copyrighted material.

there are probably several ways to implement the idea of giving the 3 choices above. here's an idea that i came up with last night:

to make a file shared only with certain members, it could be attached to a private message that is sent only to your friends list which you can create in the user control panel. to make a file public you simply attach it as you normally would, or upload it through the downloads mod, giving the file either public access or members only access.

to share a file only with contributing members, i would suggest we create a new subforum which will be a test area. we apply a mod only to that test area (the rest of the board will not be affected by the mod). we would set it up not to monetize contributions or compete for points or popularity, but to simply allow attached mp3s in the test area (and possibly certain other attachments) to be accessible only to contributing members. an mp3 attachment in any other subforum would not be affected by the mod. so it would take some careful tweaking to make it work in a much more reasonable way. the mod will not be applied to the rhythm of the month section until we are satisfied that it is working as it should on the test area. and of course we would vote on that when the time comes.

what do you folks think?

[e2c]

bubudi, re. anonymity - (whether unhealthy or not, and I'm not convinced that that it *always* the former!), there's no way to make people contribute if they don't want to. I feel very unsettled about the idea of this whole thing (points) as a way to get them to do so - I think it'll have the opposite effect. (i also think i'm repeating myself. )

All we can really do is to try and be welcoming, imo. the rest is up to the individual - as I think it should be, really.

Just my .02-worth....

Edited to add: I wonder if some of the folks who read this board don't know English well enough to be able to write in it effectively? That seems to be pretty common on some of the other boards where I'm a member. (And - i say this to my own embarrassment - I'm not able to write in any other languages myself, so I'm in the position of muddling through on many sites where I can't really contribute...)

[michi]

however, as we said, if someone wants to share a file, it's his/her prerogative who they want to share it with and if they aren't given a choice how to share it, they are likely not to. so i say give them a few choices:
1. share with everyone (make the file public)
2. share with people on a friends list
3. share with contributing members only

I agree with that. It should be the choice of the owner/uploader whom the file is shared with.

there are probably several ways to implement the idea of giving the 3 choices above. here's an idea that i came up with last night:

to make a file shared only with certain members, it could be attached to a private message that is sent only to your friends list which you can create in the user control panel. to make a file public you simply attach it as you normally would, or upload it through the downloads mod, giving the file either public access or members only access.

That sounds good to me because it leaves the choice to the poster, so we don't have a "one-size-fits-all" policy.

to share a file only with contributing members, i would suggest we create a new subforum which will be a test area. we apply a mod only to that test area (the rest of the board will not be affected by the mod).

That sounds reasonable to me too. With that, I can post to the world at large, send the file only to specific members, or make it available only to contributing members. That should keep pretty much everyone happy, I would think.

what do you folks think?

That approach is infinitely superior to the previous one, IMO

Cheers,

Michi.

[bubudi]

very good points e, re people contributing if they feel able to contribute (have something worthwhile, have the english language skills or the desire to contribute something).

i would agree with all the above in principle. i've seen some people here from europe and asia post here despite obvious language difficulties. courage to them. i hope more people will do that and i hope that at a later stage we will offer some translation of the website and a quick option to apply automated translation of forum messages into the user's language of choice.

i think most regular visitors (active or not) want to contribute, it's a matter of when and how - it may not always be a convenient time and they also need to take the time to look at the website to see how they might contribute (there are infinite possibilities once you take a look around).

but if someone only came on the site to post an advert or to access a particular piece of info they have been googling, or to check the latest download available, then they quite often might not give the site the second look that they would need to work out that it's a community that might be valuable to them, or how they might be able to contribute to it. even asking a simple question is both a contribution and an instant means of receiving something valuable from others.

whether or not we should give them a little push is something we should discuss as a separate issue.

first we have the issue of whether or not to give a person the option of who they share their files with. if any system can provide that in a convenient way, i say let's explore it further (see my suggestion above). if more people share, even to a limited audience, it's better than hardly any sharing at all.

[the kid]

I'd say let it rest til the new year

This tread should be renamed "There was a karma system briefly in djembefola.com''

Efforts and energies should be goin into the group study project

[guedom]

I think that is not the way, I like share but I m not an englih speaker so for me is difficult put reviews etc..

I read here many things very good! but if you are a begginer never will get karma for karma stuff so at the end, karma users will be a elite. And on an "ensemble" all people are importants, djabarafola, kenkenifolas, dancers, clappingfolas the world is not only around 3 ksing ksing, I know cash hand system is similar to your level here..

Other way can be (don't like really too) put a special part on djembefola.com for karma system.

If i want share info, music, video... only with/for karma members, you post in this part, all people can share here but not all can download or access, you need pay with karma cash.

anyway I think to have a true good karma better is share free

[Djembe-nerd]

I like the clappingfola I think if you don;t have a copyright, I will put it in my profile

[guedom]

hehe has copyright.. and copyleft too!! you need both to run it well then Adam you will have a copyclap

[the kid]

Now Clappingfolas cool ?

hehe has copyright.. and copyleft too!! you need both to run it well

Ok now i get it, its too cool



How many claps can we get going here ?

[the kid]

Since i'm clapping , i'd better dedicate to somebody,

to james and bubudi, for creating and moderating and all work behind the scenes
to the bots what ever they are
to the lurkers you know who you are joking, to the readers and learners
to the contributors on all levels

It takes all to make a community. Lets make it a strong one
Communicate and learn from each other,


Happy drumming

[bubudi]

I think that is not the way, I like share but I m not an englih speaker so for me is difficult put reviews etc..

hi guedom, no need to make reviews. your opinion is a contribution. so are the videos and the pieces of information that you post here from time to time.

Other way can be (don't like really too) put a special part on djembefola.com for karma system. If i want share info, music, video... only with/for karma members, you post in this part, all people can share here but not all can download or access, you need pay with karma cash.

yes, that is the idea (to have one small section or subforum with this system), just to give someone a choice if they don't want to share their files with everyone.

I'd say let it rest til the new year [...] Efforts and energies should be goin into the group study project

we definitely don't want too many distractions since we're already a 3rd of the way through the our first 'rhythm of the month' and still have a lot of ground to cover. the mod is still installed, but has been deactivated. a new test section could be set up at any point.

This tread should be renamed "There was a karma system briefly in djembefola.com''

i'll see what i can do, kid!

[e2c]

guedom - I love this new word - "clappingfola"!

And i also really like your videos. (Like the clip of Drissa Kone...)

[Paul]

Hi guys,

I am glad to hear this has been disabled.. Primarily because I was disallowed from listening to michis downloads which I think should be his decision.

My teacher was totally against recording (as he had all his music stolen and made into a cd) and I in turn have kept my views on that too... I dont have as much chance to go to Africa now as I am studying African politics and development which takes up alot of my time.. (then i will go for good)

While I am not much help on the technology front and I never write music I offer as much help or advice to people as I can and have hooked people up with teachers in Africa.. I am also very open to new people who arrive in my town and want to play.. Most of us will never meet each other but you can know that if you find yourself in Dublin on Tuesday or Thursday evenings you can come to practice.. Which I cant say for the other groups around.. This has already happened through this site and I am looking forward to welcome someone else whos work will bring them here soon.. I have in turn been invited to other places..

Karma is not as instant as all this.. And its not tit for tat

[bubudi]

Karma is not as instant as all this.. And its not tit for tat

yea it's not our mod or name. it also wasn't meant to disallow anyone from downloading those recordings or to affect other attachments. none of that would have happened if it was set up more carefully. james wanted to give it a bit of a test run first but a test area would have worked a lot more favourably. we live and learn. i actually think that this has good potential to allow people to share more if it's done the right way. we're certainly not in any hurry though. we'd rather get it right next time.