Carl Puts on his big scholastic music geek hat.

[Carl]

At the prompting of Bubudi, here's and idea that I would like to see added to djembefola.com

While there are not a great deal of formal writings on the music of West Africa, there are some. My thought is that it would be nice to be able to refer to these as "primary sources" in the more scholastic discussions around here.

What I imagine is, at minimum, a "traditional" bibliography. Basically a listing of all of the publishing info on whatever list of books/articles that we find convenient.

It would look something like this

Smith, John What I know about the djembe, John's publishing house, Townville, USA 2009

A more advanced idea is to do an "annotated bibliography" which would start with the entry above, but would continue with some sort of overview

This work gives a concise overview of the learning process that John Smith went through during the years 1999 - 2008. It covers the following rhythms (yada yada yada).

Finally, if we wanted to go "all of the way" we could link to individual journal entries for each book, where members could contribute what they think, very similar to what we do with the media review on CDs and DVDs elsewhere.

One thing which does not really fit the "bibliography" model, in tradition, would be to have links to where people could purchase each book. My preference would be to steer people as close to the writer as possible, but I could see that a link to amazon would be easier. Depending on what limitations there might be for the moderators.

Since this happens to coincide with my approach to my studies, I feel that I can volunteer to manage this project despite my current schedule. (that and my schedule should start to lighten in about two weeks.) When I was in grad school this is what I did ALL THE TIME! (yes I am still slightly traumatized by a class call "bibliography". Simple name, hardest damn class I ever took, and I took it twice! (two different teachers, but that's another whole storry)

Now, I know that this idea exists on other websites, to various degrees of complexity and accuracy. However, I see the process of putting this together as being a worth while project, and in the end, more rewarding than just going to a pre-existing list.

Anyway, thoughts?

C

[bubudi]

hey carl, i just got this picture in my head of you taking the ttm test, being quizzed on the cultural background of tiriba, and quoting all kinds of books and sources

My thought is that it would be nice to be able to refer to these as "primary sources" in the more scholastic discussions around here.

are you suggesting a page with an annotated bibliography that we can all contribute to and then link to in our messages, or do you want something more than that, where you select a source from the bibliography and all the details of the source are shown in your message?

Finally, if we wanted to go "all of the way" we could link to individual journal entries for each book, where members could contribute what they think, very similar to what we do with the media review on CDs and DVDs elsewhere.

the media section is for books as well as cds and dvds. we have also included films that are not yet available on dvd. this format already allows individual comments and questions, as well as a star rating delivered through a poll.

the way i'm seeing it is that someone's going to have to write entries in the media section about a heap of books, and some of the better cds and dvds that haven't yet been covered in the media section. and they are also going to have to add links to where to buy these goodies. don't look at me, it's not gonna happen

on top of that there needs to be a database of sources which includes: author, title, media type, year, duration of media (number of minutes or pages), publisher/producer, place of publishing/production, link to entry in media section.

then james would have to write a small bit of software which adds a bbcode that allows us to select a source from a list of sources which would automatically retrieve these details from the database when our message is viewed. i don't know how long something like this would take, but i know james has got travel plans coming up and then a few months of a busy work schedule, and if he chooses to do any software writing, he's probably more likely to work on the existing rhythm notation project.

Since this happens to coincide with my approach to my studies, I feel that I can volunteer to manage this project despite my current schedule. (that and my schedule should start to lighten in about two weeks.)

since you volunteered, we'd gladly give you this job

one question though: there are so many referencing styles to use, which one would you choose?

[Carl]

are you suggesting a page with an annotated bibliography that we can all contribute to and then link to in our messages, or do you want something more than that, where you select a source from the bibliography and all the details of the source are shown in your message?

I was just brain storming. Based on thing you said later in your post, I think the most reasonable goal would be for a basic bibliography. We could link to that page then people could scroll down to what they needed to know.

Your point about the media section is well taken. One way of making it easier would be to have links from the bibliography which pointed to the appropriate thread in the media section.

the way i'm seeing it is that someone's going to have to write entries in the media section about a heap of books, and some of the better cds and dvds that haven't yet been covered in the media section.

Yikes, that's a lot. Maybe over a few years we could get there...
I guess that I was thinking primarily about printed materials. There is not nearly as much of it as there are recordings. Also, printed materials tend to be more focused on tradition and teaching, where there are many recordings which are more "popular" in nature. In the big picture, it would be nice if at some point there were "classic recordings" which most people would agree were representative of certain styles. But that is way beyond my scope. Focusing on teaching CDs and DVDs wouldn't be as bad, but again, that is pretty heavily covered in the Media section...

since you volunteered, we'd gladly give you this job

one question though: there are so many referencing styles to use, which one would you choose?

No problem. The nice thing about reference styles is that there are so many of them, you just pick one and stick with it.

If you are serious about my being able to work on this, I would imagine that I would start with a poll on a few of the more popular reference styles. If there is not enough preference, then I'd just make a call and go with it.

One of my projects this winter is to collect a bibliography out of the books I have on hand. Mamady's book, Anke Dje Anke Be, Mande Music and others. This is a monster project, and if we can work out a system, I could update it here as I move along.

Basically, this is something I am going to do anyway. If it is reasonably easy, I would gladly share it with this community.

C

[e2c]

Carl - I'm so glad I'm not the only one with a big scholastic music geek hat!

[bubudi]

carl, yes i'm serious that you can start on this whenever you like. and possibly some others might want to help (either with reviews of books/cds/dvds or with compiling a resource list of books, cds, dvds, etc).

i also see it as an ongoing project... but one that can begin with the most important books and instructionals, then all the other books written on djembe and mande music.

as for audio recordings and instructionals, the rhythm of the month discussions will have their own resource lists, so people will know where to find all the versions of a rhythm. those can be cross-referenced to link to reviews in the media section. a list of all recordings available with links to reviews would also be good. many of the best audio recordings and instructionals have already been reviewed in the media section. there are definitely quite a few that still need to be, but it's not necessary to review every single cd or dvd out there.

i would like to explore the idea of referencing being integrated with the forum in the second way i described in my previous reply - being able to select from a list and the forum retrieves everything from the database. if it's feasible (in terms of hours of time writing code and updating databases), it will be a long term goal. in the meantime, some posts with cross-referenced bibliographies, discographies or videographies should do the trick.

as for referencing style, what are you currently using in your studies? we used mainly apa. i'm not a fan of any style that uses footnotes or cryptic jargon. simple is good.

for the non-geeks out there i'd like to reassure you that referencing will remain optional and you will be under no pressure to use it. it's merely something that will make study easier because there will be a convenient way to locate available material. in addition any reference resource will allow those that use the referencing a quicker means to locate and cite the source.

[Beerfola]

Have you heard of a software called "End Note"? It is specifically for bibliographies.

[michi]

I think having a bibliography would be really useful. I'd be more than happy to go through my library and add those titles.

As far as the style is concerned, I don't really mind. Just pick whatever one seems most reasonable to you.

BTW, there is a quite complete discography for recordings. That's certainly one source we can cross-check against if we want to add references to recordings.

Cheers,

Michi.

[bubudi]

there is a quite complete discography for recordings. That's certainly one source we can cross-check against if we want to add references to recordings.

there is?

Have you heard of a software called "End Note"? It is specifically for bibliographies.

yes we had endnote when i was a student. it's been around for years, but it's not free. you can download a free trial for 30 days on their website. you input the sources and it spits out the citations and bibliography in whatever style you want.

[the kid]

Guys this hat is huge and very geeky

[michi]

there is a quite complete discography for recordings. That's certainly one source we can cross-check against if we want to add references to recordings.

there is?

Oops, sorry, forgot to include the link.

Cheers,

Michi.

[bubudi]

aah that one. i thought you were referring to a discography here on this site. that one is quite good but not complete. but i'm sure some of us are in a position to fill in any missing details and add any recordings that aren't covered in that discography. and, if anyone has a scanner, they could contribute the covers, similar to what is done on that site, but perhaps in higher resolution.

[michi]

I'm happy to supply whatever cover art I have scanned for my iTunes library.

Cheers,

Michi.

[Carl]

Oops, sorry, forgot to include the link.

Cheers,

Michi.

Bad Michi! When the collection agency comes to see me about my credit cards, I'm going to give them your address!

C

[michi]

Bad Michi! When the collection agency comes to see me about my credit cards, I'm going to give them your address!

You are welcome. They'll find a lot of drumming CDs here, and not a lot else

Cheers,

Michi.

[Carl]

Getting back on topic.

Ok, so let's say I want to set up my first batch of entries. How should I do so? I'm not a programer, so do not let me near any code, unless you want the site to crash for a couple of days...



Formating is not an issue, tell me how you would like it, and I'm pretty sure I can make it happen.

C